http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1?format=rss Tribe.net. Local Connections http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#ce09af5d-1528-4247-bcd0-ebfc043d31e9 Given the heavy gender bias of the Catholic Church, I'm convinced it was a gender issue, despite a ban on all drums. But this is an intuition and not based on facts. If you have the chance, try and see Layne's fascingating slide show................it might make a believer out of you as well. Thu, 22 Oct 2009 00:42:55 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#ce09af5d-1528-4247-bcd0-ebfc043d31e9 Rick 2009-10-22T00:42:55Z http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#32aaf1a0-ac24-49ae-842d-860b4530d503 The Catholic church went on to ban ALL drums and forbade them to be played. When the Turks invaded, they were seen as a pagan instrument, so I'm not sure this is really a gender issue. Thu, 01 Oct 2009 00:19:21 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#32aaf1a0-ac24-49ae-842d-860b4530d503 michael 2009-10-01T00:19:21Z http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#23c68bfa-5d29-4eeb-b863-b92bf1b89739 Layne Redmond, the author of that wonderful book, is a really good friend of mine. If you ever get the chance, I can highly recommend that you take a workshop with her. At PASIC, was priviliged to be her aide in teaching a huge room of beginning beginner drummers how to play frame drums. She had the entire room playing dancing and singing, simultaneously in under an hour. It was astonishing. Also, she frequently gives a fantastic slide show when she does her talks about her book. I highly recommend this slide show as there are many slides not included in the book and her commentary is really amazing. She's the first person who really got in and heavily documented how the Catholic Church systematically tried to hide the existence of the very obvious woman frame drumming traditions from the so called 'pagan' era. I highly recommend this book for anyone interested in the history of drumming on the planet. Layne now lives, teaches, writes and studies in Brazil. Wed, 20 May 2009 16:50:20 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#23c68bfa-5d29-4eeb-b863-b92bf1b89739 Rick 2009-05-20T16:50:20Z http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#d6cd6c8d-8b4b-44ea-bccf-9835e7e63e42 I am reading a book called 'When the Women were Drummers.' "It is the story of a buried and forgotten aspect of women's spiritual heritage. It traces the use of the frame drum as a ritual instrument from the sacred caves of Old Europe through the mystery cults of Rome. It demonstrates that banning women's drumming from religious life was central to the disempowerment of women in western culture." Mon, 18 May 2009 03:06:02 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#d6cd6c8d-8b4b-44ea-bccf-9835e7e63e42 Zhalih 2009-05-18T03:06:02Z http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#bdda42d3-6100-4bdf-a04f-0fc32b953351 I have only just started learning to play the drums and im stoked! thanx for the list of female drummers, ill check it out. Sat, 31 Jan 2009 01:51:27 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#bdda42d3-6100-4bdf-a04f-0fc32b953351 Rebecca 2009-01-31T01:51:27Z http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#618f3e7f-9273-458c-9147-5b0c9a266d9f Also -- if you know of any others not already discussed in this thread, please let me know. We're building a comprehensive library of drummer biographies and always adding new entries. Check out our progress so far: http://beta.drumchannel.com/library/Library_search_page.aspx?q=&o=Relevance&d=None&act=&page=ARTISTS Feel free to make any suggestions and we'll do all we can to incorporate them into our site. Tue, 09 Dec 2008 23:11:39 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#618f3e7f-9273-458c-9147-5b0c9a266d9f Drum Channel 2008-12-09T23:11:39Z http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#a13ba831-c1c6-468e-88d3-a10446515b89 A couple others: Martina Axen Yael Benzaken Samantha Maloney Pam Manganaro Maria Martinez Dawn Richardson Ruth Underwood Mon, 08 Dec 2008 22:56:37 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#a13ba831-c1c6-468e-88d3-a10446515b89 Drum Channel 2008-12-08T22:56:37Z http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#d4715884-d991-4dbc-8df6-eee737f0b575 Off the top of my head... Karen Carpenter Cindy Blackman Terri Lyne Carrington Sheila E. Vera Figueiredo Camille Gainer Evelyn Glennie Carola Grey Susie Ibarra Hilary Jones Sherrie Maricle Kim Thompson Meg White Patty Schlemel Niki Skistmas Athena Dee Plakas Kat Kraft Elisa Pilotti Sofia Borges But, I do think that the boys out number the girls by at least 99-1 in rock music on all instruments. It is not so in jazz, classical, and other genres. I think it is the testosterone filled nature of rock-n-roll in general that attracts the boys. Wed, 13 Aug 2008 04:12:17 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#d4715884-d991-4dbc-8df6-eee737f0b575 michael 2008-08-13T04:12:17Z http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#44aecdb5-f306-4cb8-b9d2-5c4a8c72bc03 i didnt say anything about equals i admire many a woman, especially nurses ... hardcore profession and tough women usually in that role ... you may have misunderstood i just am completely against feminism and especially the anne coulter feminazi variety of that scene ... nothing good about it Wed, 13 Aug 2008 03:29:36 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#44aecdb5-f306-4cb8-b9d2-5c4a8c72bc03 SynerGy 2008-08-13T03:29:36Z http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#82f45d48-12db-423c-8914-4c0c50ab2f4f synergy, no need to start a flame war here, but Angus and I (and we've discussed it off list) are not coming from any self imposed censorship due to try to be politically correct. We both feel that women are the equals of men and have much to offer our artform, despite the fact that we happen to live in a Patriarchal culture. We both feel that it's a shame that there aren't more women drummers and percussionists in our culture because of some of the somewhat random mores of our current culture. This is a deep seated belief and doesn't have an ounce of knee jerkedness about it. We just don't agree with your attitudes towards women and it's really okay to disagree and to agree to disagree about it. yours, in the spirit of acceptance of each other despite our diversity of opinions. Rick Wed, 13 Aug 2008 01:50:05 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#82f45d48-12db-423c-8914-4c0c50ab2f4f Rick 2008-08-13T01:50:05Z http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#4ea65ea4-fc09-435b-b346-265d8947ca09 no worries here p.c. folk Tue, 12 Aug 2008 22:03:40 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#4ea65ea4-fc09-435b-b346-265d8947ca09 SynerGy 2008-08-12T22:03:40Z http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#117b1dfc-51b4-42b7-afc6-b7c0e89cb688 Agreed. ;-) Mon, 11 Aug 2008 18:35:40 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#117b1dfc-51b4-42b7-afc6-b7c0e89cb688 Angus 2008-08-11T18:35:40Z http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#98c127da-02d5-413a-a8a9-cfd479547135 LOL, Well, best of luck in the quality of women you get to be intimate with in your life, then, synerGy Sat, 09 Aug 2008 18:43:21 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#98c127da-02d5-413a-a8a9-cfd479547135 Rick 2008-08-09T18:43:21Z http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#4787b1d9-a26b-4c2f-831c-8fdc197f131a i'm all for feminism eroding Rick ! let it go bye bye . but still, yeah, you ladies need to step right up to the drum throne and bash away ... c'mon ... kid rock's drummer is a woman ... she's good ... Sat, 09 Aug 2008 14:10:53 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#4787b1d9-a26b-4c2f-831c-8fdc197f131a SynerGy 2008-08-09T14:10:53Z http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#a78940b8-9ccd-4713-95db-66a5791185e1 I have taught drums to a little over 3,000 private students in my long career as a teacher. I live in a very , very liberal area, Santa Cruz, California and 15 years ago, my students were running about 40%/60% women to men, but I have to say that sadly, in the past 5 years the number of women and girl drum students has dwindled precariously. It's funny, but it seems like many of the advances in feminism from the 60's and 70's have really eroded in the past 10 years in the United States (at least on the Left Coast where I live). I think the reason there are fewer drum students , however, is sexual acculturation and not biologically based. There is also a terrible misperception that drumming has to do with strength when in fact, very much like most martial arts, it doesn't have nearly as much to do with strength as it does with flexibility and the speed that accrues when we are very, very loose. You know that cliche of seeing a great drummer , "He/She makes it look effortless"? That's because , once you get good at it, It IS effortless. What I've found, though, is that because of acculturation, young women (particularly more self concious young teenage girls) have a hard time doing things that are loud and that attract attention. By the same token, I find that stereotypically, young teenage boys (and sometimes up until there mid-20s) have a really hard time playing sensitively and dynamically. In general, I try to get my women students to hit like hell and really play boldly and loudly at first and I try to get my young men students to play very quietly and dynamically at first. All of these, of course, are stereotypes but as a teacher you have to work with what is not what you wish would be. I think that women have so much to offer the world of drumming and it's great to go to PASIC annually and see the small minority of young and mature women who brave the masses of male drummers and really go for it. To the person who said she doesn't have the body strength to be a good drummer, go find a really, good professional drummer to study with..................you CAN DRUM and you can drum strongly without upper body strength. Sat, 09 Aug 2008 10:37:25 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#a78940b8-9ccd-4713-95db-66a5791185e1 Rick 2008-08-09T10:37:25Z http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#4ef9b565-70f5-43f5-929c-7d969f26d72b Interesting topic, Mr. Dude. I started as a hand banging AC/DC guy and encountered zero female drummers. In my 20's I switched to hand percussion and played in a afrocuban drum troupe for 4+ years. There I encountered at least 50% females, and they were awesome drummers. And here is your sexist cliche for the day: The women seemed to have a much easier time working as an ensemble. Nowadays I do mostly music for public rituals and pagan ceremonies and here I have met and worked with another whole slew of female drummers, most of them belly dancers as well. With regards to strength: You don't need to be STRONG to be a drummer - although it helps when your moving your crrrrap from the van to the stage. Let me qualify that: You don't need slow-twitch muscles to lift a pair of drumsticks, but you need to fast-twitch strong to move from pattern to pattern. What you need most of all is to be in good shape cardio-vascularly. Because even though you won't be lifting anything heavy, you'll still be carrying the band. ;-) Sat, 09 Aug 2008 01:09:16 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#4ef9b565-70f5-43f5-929c-7d969f26d72b Angus 2008-08-09T01:09:16Z http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#6b64d4a5-acfd-4fda-840b-7dcb9a75709b I teach both guitar & percussion and have done so for years. Based on my experience, I'd say your question is off-mark. My classes run roughly 50/50 for both instruments. The only disclaimer I have is I teach general (but primarily beginner-level) percussion, but teach guitar/bass at all levels, from beginner to advanced. At the advanced level, the numbers differ greatly. Given that, I think the more salient question is: Why are there so few female musicians performing at a high level? The answer, I suspect, has to do with sexism in the music industry (specifically) and sexism in our culture (in general).. Female singers are widely accepted, but females playing any other instrument have to work twice as hard for the gigs. They are told from the moment they start getting good that they need to think about "practical matters". In fairness, so are boys, but the pressure to treat your instrument as a hobby is much less severe. That said, this trend doesn't seem to exist with my younger students. I suspect the stresses are weakening due to prominent female instrumentalists specifically, and more open attitudes regarding gender in general within Western culture. I suspect as these kids get older, you'll see professional musicians playing great music of all styles regardless of gender, race, and other issues. Fri, 08 Aug 2008 19:32:21 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#6b64d4a5-acfd-4fda-840b-7dcb9a75709b David M. 2008-08-08T19:32:21Z http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#c34ee855-ecf3-486e-9488-670a619aefe2 If I did have any musical ability I probably wouldn't pick the drums because I don't have hardly any upper body strength, it's all in my legs. Drummers make it look like they are very strong. Is that just a show? Also, there just plain don't seem to be very many females who play instruments compared to how many men there are. Why is that? I don't know. Fri, 08 Aug 2008 18:09:45 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#c34ee855-ecf3-486e-9488-670a619aefe2 Christine 2008-08-08T18:09:45Z http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#e09871a9-81c7-4e20-b4e4-50ffbffd6513 Hi all! Yesterday when I wrote a reply to a post it struck me: Why are there so few female drummers? I mean a good female drummer is something wonderful, a beautiful sight and simply way cool! No, it's not a fetish of mine, but almost :-) So: Why are there so few women beating the drums? Any ideas? Comments? Any female drummers around? I'm so excrutiatingly curious! Gaaaaah! Regards, LeDude Fri, 08 Aug 2008 18:04:17 GMT http://ilikedrums.tribe.net/thread/88e6b370-a258-40a1-beb9-eac09856eec1#e09871a9-81c7-4e20-b4e4-50ffbffd6513 LeDude 2008-08-08T18:04:17Z